Debate: Tang Tornados

[The NY Gecko]

Me and Paul Reschke (leosforless) had a nice little arguement over the tangerine tornado concept. He believes that after working 10 years on a morph to make it great means you should get to name it something. I believe that regardless of how nice the animal is, the genetics haven't changed and all it is is a SHTCTB, very nice, extremely nice, but still a SHTCTB.

What are your views?

in hindsight i just realized this shouldve gone in the morphs and genetics section, apologies ladies and gents.

 

[Marc118]

I agree with Paul. Tornados are nothing less than stunning IMO. But I see what your saying....its still a SHTCTB with intense coloring.

 

[The NY Gecko]

I feel its okay to name the line, Urban Tang, CT, whatever. But changing the name to make it a new morph is rediculous. The animals still have the same basic genetics as any other SHTCTB. While they look different, its still the same morph. It isnt a new morph. Its an exceptional example of an old morph, why rename it?

 

[Marc118]

I think UG still recognizes that they are SHTCTB's but they want a name that people will relate the coloring to thier operation. Naming the Urban Tangs is the same thing.

 

[Montezuma]

I think UG still recognizes that they are SHTCTB's but they want a name that people will relate the coloring to thier operation. Naming the Urban Tangs is the same thing.

It's their entire marketing plan... make an improvement on something then rename it (whether the improvement is large or small). It really is brilliant cause it has us talking about it here (free advertsing for UG) doesn't it.

 

[ExcessiveHerps]

Me and Paul Reschke (leosforless) had a nice little arguement over the tangerine tornado concept. He believes that after working 10 years on a morph to make it great means you should get to name it something. I believe that regardless of how nice the animal is, the genetics haven't changed and all it is is a SHTCTB, very nice, extremely nice, but still a SHTCTB.

What are your views?

in hindsight i just realized this shouldve gone in the morphs and genetics section, apologies ladies and gents.

Well Craig hasn't been working with his SHTCTB for 10 years, has it even been that long since the very first CT where released? In either case he is only doing it for marketing his line is one of the best and I don't see an issue with him coining it a serperate name I agree with whats already been said they qare just just exceptional SHTCTB.

 

[Jeremy Letkey]

I say that as a seller, if you feel that you have something special to offer, call it whatever you want. The consumer who is going to spend money on a highend animal will hopefully have educated themselves enough to know excatly what they are getting.

Maybe I'm biased, for having played the name game myself?

 

[eyelids]

I say that as a seller, if you feel that you have something special to offer, call it whatever you want. The consumer who is going to spend money on a highend animal will hopefully have educated themselves enough to know excatly what they are getting.

Maybe I'm biased, for having played the name game myself?

Yeah Jeremy, but those RRS are outrageous! As far as TTs go Kelli's Electric line tops them no doubt. I can't wait to see her Tang babies from the sweet PRS!:main_thumbsup:

 

[chad e]

i.m.o. you should only name something if you added something new to the equation that breeds true. 'Raining Red Stripes' are the first red stripe rainwaters. so in your case, jeremy, i don't see an issue. but it seems like lately everyone has thier own brand of tangs and whose to say they arent all from the same line? it just confuses things. eventually people will ask what the difference between a "tangerine tornado" is and a "electric tang". and without using the words "HISS" or "Urban" it would be difficult to explain.

 

[LeosForLess]

A problem i saw is that if you cross 2 different lines, chances are you will get a lot of Hypo Tangs from brilliant SHTCTB breeders. So if i were to buy two SHTCTB's and breed them, buynig both from sombody who got them from different lines, i coudl think i will produce SHTCTB, but i very well may get HT. In the end, its mostly for credit to the brreeder, but sometimes it is just for marketing.

 

[Jedi Master Bruce]

I actually purchased nine or ten Tangerine Tornados from Urban Gecko last year. The Tornados and a Kelli Hammack gecko and a few others are the kings of my collection. In my opinion, they are a distinct development/improvement in the SHCTB type. I have several 2006 babies from the Tornado males crossed with various SHCTB females from other top lines with interesting results.

By the way, many of my nice female SHCTBs were produced by members here, and are being bred to male Tornados.

 

[boutiquegecko]

Just my thought, I do agree that for some it's marketing strategy, but not always. Take Dan the Firemans new firewater tangs. He said he named them that because he as well as some others noticed that they hold thier intense tang even after breeding, which is not always the case, and that the offspring are just as intense. Now to outcross them, I'm sure you might loose some color? I wonder if Urbans or Kelli's hold thier color too?
Based on that perhaps naming the tang so people recognize what breeder you got it from who worked so very hard to get that intesity is ok? But to call it another morph, I agree that shouldn't be done, because you don't get tornado, or electric hets from breeding them to say a normal or albino.

 

[Jedi Master Bruce]

Tangerine Tornados I bought, pics courtesy of Urban Gecko:

Young Tornados:

 

[gko reptiles]

I can tell you from experience that Urban females lose a little color during breeding just like every other morph. If anyone has seen the post I put up last night ("help me translate please" or something like that) this is exactly what I was referring to. I guess I just worded it the wrong way!

My opinion on this matter is that morphs are morphs no matter how intense. Putting a "brand name" (such as Urban Tang Tornado, or something) is fine, but in the end, the leo's should still be refferred to as their true morph. Cotton is still cotton whether its made into clothes by Tommy Hilfiger or Nautica.

 

[Brian O]

I have spoken to Craig at TUG about this before. During a little rant I had over on that other forum. He will tell you they are SHT's. He doesn't use CT because that is a line from Ray Hines and would be misleading. They are amazing examples of Tangs. Hence the Tangerine in the name.
If you put a TT next to a SHT its crazy to lablel them the same thing. Why not call Sunglows and Hybinos albino tangs? For that matter why even use Super or Baldy? Personally I think it just helps to point out the obvious and justify the price differences. Like I said once before, I believe that there are tangs that have enough of a color difference to justify a change in labeling. Which is why we see the TT, Electric Tangs, Hot Gecko Tang tags. I don't think you would see this if there were another identifying classification. The only problem would be getting anyone to agree on anything.

 

[eyelids]

Young Tornados:

The force is strong with these two Bruce!

 

[Blazin]

Hey Bruce. Can't wait to see some of those screamin Tangs out of all the top notch animals you purchased. Tangs are still my favorites!

 

[LeosForLess]

Bruce, do you have any pics of them more recently?

 

[chad e]

Why not call Sunglows and Hybinos albino tangs?

because they are also hypo! and "albino hypo tangerine" is just too long!

 

[KelliH]

I don't want to have to close this thread, because it is a great discussion. However, whatever the situation regarding Bruce and Phil/Christine needs to be discussed in the Business section, so if one of you would be so kind as to start a thread there... I will move or delete the posts relating to the business situation that are in this thread to the new one, when it is posted in the proper forum. Thanks.